# Beeminding your beeminding with goal backpressure **URL:** \ **Category:** uncategorized\ **Created:** [July 9, 2014, 7:58pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511 "2014-07-09T19:58:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![David\_MacIver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/david_maciver/32/684_2.png) [@David\_MacIver](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/David_MacIver)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2014, 7:58pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/1 "2014-07-09T19:58:43Z")
Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer eep days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal for doing so. Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a week of buffer left, automated by a python script ( [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will start to derail. I wrote a bit more about this here: [http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) David – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). ---
**Author:** ![dreev](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/dreev/32/4311_2.png) [@dreev](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/dreev)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2014, 10:00pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/2 "2014-07-09T22:00:28Z")
Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related idea we’ve been kicking around: https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM.html On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver [david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com) wrote: > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer eep > days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal for > doing so. > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a week > of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > start to derail. > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > David > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) ---
**Author:** ![drmaciver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/drmaciver/32/80_2.png) [@drmaciver](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/drmaciver)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2014, 7:41pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/3 "2014-07-10T19:41:07Z")
Initial feedback: Oh gods was I overoptimistic about the rate setting. I’m probably going to derail this due to bad planning. I think 1/day is perfectly reasonable long term, but it’s a lot harder to clear down from 2 a day to 1 a day than I was thinking (because you probably need to do about a week’s worth of goal!). On the plus side, it’s definitely working to achieve the intended result. I’ve got a _lot_ of gym time and reading done since starting this. On 10 July 2014 00:00, Daniel Reeves [dreeves@beeminder.com](mailto:dreeves@beeminder.com) wrote: > Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related > idea we’ve been kicking around: > [Trello](https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM/609-metamind-meta-goals-fuer-alles) > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver [david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com) > wrote: > > > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer eep > > days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal for > > doing so. > > > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a week > > of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > > start to derail. > > > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > > > David > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” > Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). ---
**Author:** ![Philip\_Hellyer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/philip_hellyer/32/675_2.png) [@Philip\_Hellyer](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/Philip_Hellyer)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2014, 12:12pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/4 "2014-07-11T12:12:22Z")
Hi David! That’s pretty awesome. I’ve beeminded my beeminding using a less ambitious (and sadly manual) idea. It’s taken 2 forms over time: JFDI Before Lunch : I have to despatch all of my beemergencies in the morning. Danny used a more extreme version, in which he didn’t eat anything before getting his beemergencies out of the way. Here’s how I described it at the time: > I have a meta goal (pjh/jfdi) that encourages me to get beemergencies out > of > the way before lunch. It started life as a binary, but that soon got out > of > hand… so now I count fractional success: e.g. if there are 5 > beemergencies > today and I get 2 of them done before lunch, then thats 0.4 points. The > akratic nirvana of having safety buffer on all goals is worth 1 point. > > “before lunch” turns out to be usefully soft. It’s not a hard deadline > like > midnight or 3AM, so it helps me think about whether eating right now is > what > my body needs, or whether I can fit a task in first, (or whether lunch is > worth an extra $5 today!). Certainly it means that I’m more likely to be > free in the evenings. > > Current weekly slope is 4, meaning that slightly more that half of my > beemergencies need to be dealt with promptly each day. The goal text says > it > all: eep-less-ness. After doing that for a while, I realised that I needed to move my planning further upstream. Not just doing things in the morning, but making sure that my entire set of goals was manageable. Here’s the fine print from that goal > Every now and again, I will get all of my goals into blue or green, so > that > there are no emergency days on the following day. > > Orange goals are allowed, but they must have a tick-mark. This in > particular > includes the subset of goals that can be done at most once per day. > > Goals that can’t be decided until the day itself don’t count. I’m really glad that someone has started down the path of automating the beeminding of their beeminding. I think there’s a rich vein of functionality in there. Thanks for sharing your script. Philip [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for your important goals On 10 July 2014 20:41, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > Initial feedback: Oh gods was I overoptimistic about the rate setting. I’m > probably going to derail this due to bad planning. > > I think 1/day is perfectly reasonable long term, but it’s a lot harder to > clear down from 2 a day to 1 a day than I was thinking (because you > probably need to do about a week’s worth of goal!). > > On the plus side, it’s definitely working to achieve the intended result. > I’ve got a _lot_ of gym time and reading done since starting this. > > On 10 July 2014 00:00, Daniel Reeves [dreeves@beeminder.com](mailto:dreeves@beeminder.com) wrote: > > > Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related > > idea we’ve been kicking around: > > [Trello](https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM/609-metamind-meta-goals-fuer-alles) > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver [david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com) > > wrote: > > > > > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > > > > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer eep > > > days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal for > > > doing so. > > > > > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a week > > > of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > > > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > > > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > > > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > > > start to derail. > > > > > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > > > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > > > > > David > > > > > > – > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > – > > [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” > > Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). ---
**Author:** ![drmaciver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/drmaciver/32/80_2.png) [@drmaciver](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/drmaciver)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2014, 1:09pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/5 "2014-07-11T13:09:45Z")
Cool! How does the morning thing work out for you? Is your schedule / what you’re beeminding sufficiently flexible that you can manage to take mornings to focus on it? I don’t think the 7 day buffer is actually any harder than a shorter one. It just requires more initial work. Once you’re on target they move at the same rate. BTW, your email suggests that most days are a beeminder emergency day for you. That sounds extreme. Is that a normal usage pattern? How many goals do you have? Are they all designed to push you quite hard? David P.S. For those who were waiting with bated breath to find out if I derailed, turns out things were less extreme than I feared. I’ve actually managed to get things under control. For the moment at least I have everything with more than 7 days of buffer, though gym is going to fall off that tomorrow. Hi David! That’s pretty awesome. I’ve beeminded my beeminding using a less ambitious (and sadly manual) idea. It’s taken 2 forms over time: JFDI Before Lunch : I have to despatch all of my beemergencies in the morning. Danny used a more extreme version, in which he didn’t eat anything before getting his beemergencies out of the way. Here’s how I described it at the time: > I have a meta goal (pjh/jfdi) that encourages me to get beemergencies out > of > the way before lunch. It started life as a binary, but that soon got out > of > hand… so now I count fractional success: e.g. if there are 5 > beemergencies > today and I get 2 of them done before lunch, then thats 0.4 points. The > akratic nirvana of having safety buffer on all goals is worth 1 point. > > “before lunch” turns out to be usefully soft. It’s not a hard deadline > like > midnight or 3AM, so it helps me think about whether eating right now is > what > my body needs, or whether I can fit a task in first, (or whether lunch is > worth an extra $5 today!). Certainly it means that I’m more likely to be > free in the evenings. > > Current weekly slope is 4, meaning that slightly more that half of my > beemergencies need to be dealt with promptly each day. The goal text says > it > all: eep-less-ness. After doing that for a while, I realised that I needed to move my planning further upstream. Not just doing things in the morning, but making sure that my entire set of goals was manageable. Here’s the fine print from that goal > Every now and again, I will get all of my goals into blue or green, so > that > there are no emergency days on the following day. > > Orange goals are allowed, but they must have a tick-mark. This in > particular > includes the subset of goals that can be done at most once per day. > > Goals that can’t be decided until the day itself don’t count. I’m really glad that someone has started down the path of automating the beeminding of their beeminding. I think there’s a rich vein of functionality in there. Thanks for sharing your script. Philip [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for your important goals On 10 July 2014 20:41, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > Initial feedback: Oh gods was I overoptimistic about the rate setting. I’m > probably going to derail this due to bad planning. > > I think 1/day is perfectly reasonable long term, but it’s a lot harder to > clear down from 2 a day to 1 a day than I was thinking (because you > probably need to do about a week’s worth of goal!). > > On the plus side, it’s definitely working to achieve the intended result. > I’ve got a _lot_ of gym time and reading done since starting this. > > On 10 July 2014 00:00, Daniel Reeves [dreeves@beeminder.com](mailto:dreeves@beeminder.com) wrote: > > > Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related > > idea we’ve been kicking around: > > [Trello](https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM/609-metamind-meta-goals-fuer-alles) > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver [david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com) > > wrote: > > > > > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > > > > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer eep > > > days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal for > > > doing so. > > > > > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a week > > > of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > > > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > > > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > > > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > > > start to derail. > > > > > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > > > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > > > > > David > > > > > > – > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > – > > [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” > > Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). ---
**Author:** ![Philip\_Hellyer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/philip_hellyer/32/675_2.png) [@Philip\_Hellyer](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/Philip_Hellyer)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2014, 4:17pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/6 "2014-07-11T16:17:14Z")
At current count, I’ve got 38 active goals. A goodly number of them have conservative slopes and make use of the (Plan Bee) feature of auto-ratcheting to ensure that I don’t forget about them altogether. The more important the goal, the more insistently it should push me. If you’re morbidly curious, I drafted a blog post about the types of goals that I’m beeminding: > **[How I Use Beeminder](http://expost.padm.us/howeyeuse)** > > This is a case-study post by our own > Philip Hellyer > which also expands on our previous post, > Beating Beeminder Burnout. > Despite not being a > Qua... The difficulty about reliably having a free morning is what prompted me to go to the ‘day before’ version. That and a need to force myself to look more than one step into the future… Philip [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for future leverage On 11 July 2014 14:09, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > Cool! > > How does the morning thing work out for you? Is your schedule / what > you’re beeminding sufficiently flexible that you can manage to take > mornings to focus on it? > > I don’t think the 7 day buffer is actually any harder than a shorter one. > It just requires more initial work. Once you’re on target they move at the > same rate. > > BTW, your email suggests that most days are a beeminder emergency day for > you. That sounds extreme. Is that a normal usage pattern? How many goals do > you have? Are they all designed to push you quite hard? > > David > > P.S. For those who were waiting with bated breath to find out if I > derailed, turns out things were less extreme than I feared. I’ve actually > managed to get things under control. For the moment at least I have > everything with more than 7 days of buffer, though gym is going to fall off > that tomorrow. > Hi David! > > That’s pretty awesome. I’ve beeminded my beeminding using a less ambitious > (and sadly manual) idea. It’s taken 2 forms over time: > > JFDI Before Lunch : I have to despatch all of my beemergencies in the > morning. Danny used a more extreme version, in which he didn’t eat anything > before getting his beemergencies out of the way. Here’s how I described it > at the time: > > > I have a meta goal (pjh/jfdi) that encourages me to get beemergencies > > out of > > the way before lunch. It started life as a binary, but that soon got out > > of > > hand… so now I count fractional success: e.g. if there are 5 > > beemergencies > > today and I get 2 of them done before lunch, then thats 0.4 points. The > > akratic nirvana of having safety buffer on all goals is worth 1 point. > > > > “before lunch” turns out to be usefully soft. It’s not a hard deadline > > like > > midnight or 3AM, so it helps me think about whether eating right now is > > what > > my body needs, or whether I can fit a task in first, (or whether lunch is > > worth an extra $5 today!). Certainly it means that I’m more likely to be > > free in the evenings. > > > > Current weekly slope is 4, meaning that slightly more that half of my > > beemergencies need to be dealt with promptly each day. The goal text > > says it > > all: eep-less-ness. > > After doing that for a while, I realised that I needed to move my planning > further upstream. Not just doing things in the morning, but making sure > that my entire set of goals was manageable. Here’s the fine print from that > goal > > > Every now and again, I will get all of my goals into blue or green, so > > that > > there are no emergency days on the following day. > > > > Orange goals are allowed, but they must have a tick-mark. This in > > particular > > includes the subset of goals that can be done at most once per day. > > > > Goals that can’t be decided until the day itself don’t count. > > I’m really glad that someone has started down the path of automating the > beeminding of their beeminding. I think there’s a rich vein of > functionality in there. Thanks for sharing your script. > > Philip > [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for your important goals > > On 10 July 2014 20:41, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > > > Initial feedback: Oh gods was I overoptimistic about the rate setting. > > I’m probably going to derail this due to bad planning. > > > > I think 1/day is perfectly reasonable long term, but it’s a lot harder to > > clear down from 2 a day to 1 a day than I was thinking (because you > > probably need to do about a week’s worth of goal!). > > > > On the plus side, it’s definitely working to achieve the intended result. > > I’ve got a _lot_ of gym time and reading done since starting this. > > > > On 10 July 2014 00:00, Daniel Reeves [dreeves@beeminder.com](mailto:dreeves@beeminder.com) wrote: > > > > > Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related > > > idea we’ve been kicking around: > > > [Trello](https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM/609-metamind-meta-goals-fuer-alles) > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver [david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com) > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > > > > > > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer eep > > > > days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal for > > > > doing so. > > > > > > > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a > > > > week of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > > > > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > > > > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > > > > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > > > > start to derail. > > > > > > > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > > > > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > > > > > > > David > > > > > > > > – > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > – > > > [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” > > > Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) > > > > > > – > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. 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**Author:** ![drmaciver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/drmaciver/32/80_2.png) [@drmaciver](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/drmaciver)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2014, 6:03pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/7 "2014-07-11T18:03:53Z")
Ah, auto-ratcheting is neat. I’d either not noticed or not really thought about that before. I’ve one goal that I’ll definitely apply that to (I have a word-count goal on my blog, but my blogging tends to be very bursty so what will happen is I write three long posts in short succession and suddenly have two months of buffer left (which I would sometimes manually ratchet down, but still). Being able to enforce a cap on that is nice. The blog post is interesting, thanks. How lenient are your in setting your outcome goals? I confess to being quite afraid of the idea of outcome goals and have so far avoided them entirely - the only goals I have set are ones where there’s a direct linear relationship between a thing I do and the data that gets entered into beeminder (words written, time spent on an activity, etc) so that the thing that causes me to potentially derail is always “I didn’t do enough X” (or “I did too much X”). I’ve currently got a bit less than half that number of goals, but I suspect I’ll be getting there alarmingly quickly. Right now I’m mostly setting my beeminders to rates that are reasonably easy to achieve but that I would probably fail to do so due to sheer procrastination / weak will and increasing the pressure over time by bringing more and more things under the aegis of beeminder. On the backpressure front: I’ve realised it works terribly for “Do Less” goals, because the problem is that the only way to affect them is to sit there, which may mean there’s nothing you can do to stop the backpressure from derailing. I’ve modified my script to only apply to hustler goal types (and edited out the datapoints that were from non-hustler goals. This feels a bit weaselly, but I think it’s legit). I am considering creating a do more goal to complement my do less goals in the same way that backpressure is a do less goal to complement my do more goals. David On 11 July 2014 18:17, Philip Hellyer [philip@hellyer.net](mailto:philip@hellyer.net) wrote: > At current count, I’ve got 38 active goals. A goodly number of them have > conservative slopes and make use of the (Plan Bee) feature of > auto-ratcheting to ensure that I don’t forget about them altogether. The > more important the goal, the more insistently it should push me. > > If you’re morbidly curious, I drafted a blog post about the types of goals > that I’m beeminding: > [How I Use Beeminder](http://expost.padm.us/howeyeuse) > > The difficulty about reliably having a free morning is what prompted me to > go to the ‘day before’ version. That and a need to force myself to look > more than one step into the future… > > Philip > [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for future leverage > > On 11 July 2014 14:09, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > > > Cool! > > > > How does the morning thing work out for you? Is your schedule / what > > you’re beeminding sufficiently flexible that you can manage to take > > mornings to focus on it? > > > > I don’t think the 7 day buffer is actually any harder than a shorter > > one. It just requires more initial work. Once you’re on target they move at > > the same rate. > > > > BTW, your email suggests that most days are a beeminder emergency day for > > you. That sounds extreme. Is that a normal usage pattern? How many goals do > > you have? Are they all designed to push you quite hard? > > > > David > > > > P.S. For those who were waiting with bated breath to find out if I > > derailed, turns out things were less extreme than I feared. I’ve actually > > managed to get things under control. For the moment at least I have > > everything with more than 7 days of buffer, though gym is going to fall off > > that tomorrow. > > Hi David! > > > > That’s pretty awesome. I’ve beeminded my beeminding using a less > > ambitious (and sadly manual) idea. It’s taken 2 forms over time: > > > > JFDI Before Lunch : I have to despatch all of my beemergencies in the > > morning. Danny used a more extreme version, in which he didn’t eat anything > > before getting his beemergencies out of the way. Here’s how I described it > > at the time: > > > > > I have a meta goal (pjh/jfdi) that encourages me to get beemergencies > > > out of > > > the way before lunch. It started life as a binary, but that soon got > > > out of > > > hand… so now I count fractional success: e.g. if there are 5 > > > beemergencies > > > today and I get 2 of them done before lunch, then thats 0.4 points. The > > > akratic nirvana of having safety buffer on all goals is worth 1 point. > > > > > > “before lunch” turns out to be usefully soft. It’s not a hard deadline > > > like > > > midnight or 3AM, so it helps me think about whether eating right now is > > > what > > > my body needs, or whether I can fit a task in first, (or whether lunch > > > is > > > worth an extra $5 today!). Certainly it means that I’m more likely to be > > > free in the evenings. > > > > > > Current weekly slope is 4, meaning that slightly more that half of my > > > beemergencies need to be dealt with promptly each day. The goal text > > > says it > > > all: eep-less-ness. > > > > After doing that for a while, I realised that I needed to move my > > planning further upstream. Not just doing things in the morning, but making > > sure that my entire set of goals was manageable. Here’s the fine print from > > that goal > > > > > Every now and again, I will get all of my goals into blue or green, so > > > that > > > there are no emergency days on the following day. > > > > > > Orange goals are allowed, but they must have a tick-mark. This in > > > particular > > > includes the subset of goals that can be done at most once per day. > > > > > > Goals that can’t be decided until the day itself don’t count. > > > > I’m really glad that someone has started down the path of automating the > > beeminding of their beeminding. I think there’s a rich vein of > > functionality in there. Thanks for sharing your script. > > > > Philip > > [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for your important goals > > > > On 10 July 2014 20:41, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > > > > > Initial feedback: Oh gods was I overoptimistic about the rate setting. > > > I’m probably going to derail this due to bad planning. > > > > > > I think 1/day is perfectly reasonable long term, but it’s a lot harder > > > to clear down from 2 a day to 1 a day than I was thinking (because you > > > probably need to do about a week’s worth of goal!). > > > > > > On the plus side, it’s definitely working to achieve the intended > > > result. I’ve got a _lot_ of gym time and reading done since starting > > > this. > > > > > > On 10 July 2014 00:00, Daniel Reeves [dreeves@beeminder.com](mailto:dreeves@beeminder.com) wrote: > > > > > > > Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related > > > > idea we’ve been kicking around: > > > > [Trello](https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM/609-metamind-meta-goals-fuer-alles) > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver \<[david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com) > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > > > > > > > > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer > > > > > eep days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal > > > > > for doing so. > > > > > > > > > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a > > > > > week of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > > > > > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > > > > > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > > > > > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > > > > > start to derail. > > > > > > > > > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > > > > > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > > > > > > > > > David > > > > > > > > > > – > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > > > – > > > > [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” > > > > Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) > > > > > > > > – > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > – > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). ---
**Author:** ![Philip\_Hellyer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/forum.beeminder.com/philip_hellyer/32/675_2.png) [@Philip\_Hellyer](https://forum.beeminder.com/u/Philip_Hellyer)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2014, 7:05pm UTC](https://forum.beeminder.com/t/beeminding-your-beeminding-with-goal-backpressure/1511/8 "2014-07-11T19:05:47Z")
I currently have 3 outcome goals, and they’re super-lenient. Arguably they’re just ‘tracking’ rather than ‘achieving’. If they ever lapse enough to be ‘on the road’ then that’s a signal that the supporting goals aren’t tuned right. Beeminder may not be the best place to track outcomes, but putting all of the graphs in the same place seems like a Good Thing. A super-lenient example: my weight goal is set to -0.05 kg per week, or about half a pound each month. It’s got no autoratchet or any magic, just gently encourages my weight in a non-upwards direction. I’ve got more rigorous gym, run, and eating goals. I can’t claim success yet through this approach, since I’ve fallen off all of those roads recently. But I’m certain that I’m in better shape than I would have been without them. Almost by definition, my outcome goals have the most safety buffer, so I’ve also gone to the “terrifyingly advanced” settings page and set the “panic threshold” to something large. This forces them to the top of the sort order in my gallery. Otherwise they’d be too out of sight for my brain. Philip p.s. I was wondering how you were planning to distinguish between goals on the backpressure front. IIRC, essentiae’s awesome dashboard script makes use of 2-letter tags in the goal names to include or exclude goals from particular algorithms. On 11 July 2014 19:03, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > Ah, auto-ratcheting is neat. I’d either not noticed or not really thought > about that before. I’ve one goal that I’ll definitely apply that to (I have > a word-count goal on my blog, but my blogging tends to be very bursty so > what will happen is I write three long posts in short succession and > suddenly have two months of buffer left (which I would sometimes manually > ratchet down, but still). Being able to enforce a cap on that is nice. > > The blog post is interesting, thanks. How lenient are your in setting your > outcome goals? I confess to being quite afraid of the idea of outcome goals > and have so far avoided them entirely - the only goals I have set are ones > where there’s a direct linear relationship between a thing I do and the > data that gets entered into beeminder (words written, time spent on an > activity, etc) so that the thing that causes me to potentially derail is > always “I didn’t do enough X” (or “I did too much X”). > > I’ve currently got a bit less than half that number of goals, but I > suspect I’ll be getting there alarmingly quickly. Right now I’m mostly > setting my beeminders to rates that are reasonably easy to achieve but that > I would probably fail to do so due to sheer procrastination / weak will and > increasing the pressure over time by bringing more and more things under > the aegis of beeminder. > > On the backpressure front: I’ve realised it works terribly for “Do Less” > goals, because the problem is that the only way to affect them is to sit > there, which may mean there’s nothing you can do to stop the backpressure > from derailing. I’ve modified my script to only apply to hustler goal types > (and edited out the datapoints that were from non-hustler goals. This feels > a bit weaselly, but I think it’s legit). I am considering creating a do > more goal to complement my do less goals in the same way that backpressure > is a do less goal to complement my do more goals. > > David > > On 11 July 2014 18:17, Philip Hellyer [philip@hellyer.net](mailto:philip@hellyer.net) wrote: > > > At current count, I’ve got 38 active goals. A goodly number of them have > > conservative slopes and make use of the (Plan Bee) feature of > > auto-ratcheting to ensure that I don’t forget about them altogether. The > > more important the goal, the more insistently it should push me. > > > > If you’re morbidly curious, I drafted a blog post about the types of > > goals that I’m beeminding: > > [How I Use Beeminder](http://expost.padm.us/howeyeuse) > > > > The difficulty about reliably having a free morning is what prompted me > > to go to the ‘day before’ version. That and a need to force myself to look > > more than one step into the future… > > > > Philip > > [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for future leverage > > > > On 11 July 2014 14:09, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > > > > > Cool! > > > > > > How does the morning thing work out for you? Is your schedule / what > > > you’re beeminding sufficiently flexible that you can manage to take > > > mornings to focus on it? > > > > > > I don’t think the 7 day buffer is actually any harder than a shorter > > > one. It just requires more initial work. Once you’re on target they move at > > > the same rate. > > > > > > BTW, your email suggests that most days are a beeminder emergency day > > > for you. That sounds extreme. Is that a normal usage pattern? How many > > > goals do you have? Are they all designed to push you quite hard? > > > > > > David > > > > > > P.S. For those who were waiting with bated breath to find out if I > > > derailed, turns out things were less extreme than I feared. I’ve actually > > > managed to get things under control. For the moment at least I have > > > everything with more than 7 days of buffer, though gym is going to fall off > > > that tomorrow. > > > Hi David! > > > > > > That’s pretty awesome. I’ve beeminded my beeminding using a less > > > ambitious (and sadly manual) idea. It’s taken 2 forms over time: > > > > > > JFDI Before Lunch : I have to despatch all of my beemergencies in the > > > morning. Danny used a more extreme version, in which he didn’t eat anything > > > before getting his beemergencies out of the way. Here’s how I described it > > > at the time: > > > > > > > I have a meta goal (pjh/jfdi) that encourages me to get beemergencies > > > > out of > > > > the way before lunch. It started life as a binary, but that soon got > > > > out of > > > > hand… so now I count fractional success: e.g. if there are 5 > > > > beemergencies > > > > today and I get 2 of them done before lunch, then thats 0.4 points. > > > > The > > > > akratic nirvana of having safety buffer on all goals is worth 1 point. > > > > > > > > “before lunch” turns out to be usefully soft. It’s not a hard deadline > > > > like > > > > midnight or 3AM, so it helps me think about whether eating right now > > > > is what > > > > my body needs, or whether I can fit a task in first, (or whether lunch > > > > is > > > > worth an extra $5 today!). Certainly it means that I’m more likely to > > > > be > > > > free in the evenings. > > > > > > > > Current weekly slope is 4, meaning that slightly more that half of my > > > > beemergencies need to be dealt with promptly each day. The goal text > > > > says it > > > > all: eep-less-ness. > > > > > > After doing that for a while, I realised that I needed to move my > > > planning further upstream. Not just doing things in the morning, but making > > > sure that my entire set of goals was manageable. Here’s the fine print from > > > that goal > > > > > > > Every now and again, I will get all of my goals into blue or green, so > > > > that > > > > there are no emergency days on the following day. > > > > > > > > Orange goals are allowed, but they must have a tick-mark. This in > > > > particular > > > > includes the subset of goals that can be done at most once per day. > > > > > > > > Goals that can’t be decided until the day itself don’t count. > > > > > > I’m really glad that someone has started down the path of automating the > > > beeminding of their beeminding. I think there’s a rich vein of > > > functionality in there. Thanks for sharing your script. > > > > > > Philip > > > [beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) — for your important goals > > > > > > On 10 July 2014 20:41, David MacIver [david@drmaciver.com](mailto:david@drmaciver.com) wrote: > > > > > > > Initial feedback: Oh gods was I overoptimistic about the rate setting. > > > > I’m probably going to derail this due to bad planning. > > > > > > > > I think 1/day is perfectly reasonable long term, but it’s a lot harder > > > > to clear down from 2 a day to 1 a day than I was thinking (because you > > > > probably need to do about a week’s worth of goal!). > > > > > > > > On the plus side, it’s definitely working to achieve the intended > > > > result. I’ve got a _lot_ of gym time and reading done since starting > > > > this. > > > > > > > > On 10 July 2014 00:00, Daniel Reeves [dreeves@beeminder.com](mailto:dreeves@beeminder.com) wrote: > > > > > > > > > Love it! To repeat what we chimed in with on twitter, here’s a related > > > > > idea we’ve been kicking around: > > > > > [Trello](https://trello.com/c/QIrEJypM/609-metamind-meta-goals-fuer-alles) > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 12:58 PM, David MacIver \< > > > > > [david.maciver@gmail.com](mailto:david.maciver@gmail.com)\> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Here’s a thing I’ve done that might be of general interest: > > > > > > > > > > > > I wanted to get into a beeminding usage pattern that involved fewer > > > > > > eep days and more of a buffer on my goals, so I created a beeminder goal > > > > > > for doing so. > > > > > > > > > > > > Basic idea: Have a “do less” goal for having goals with less than a > > > > > > week of buffer left, automated by a python script ( > > > > > > [https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py](https://github.com/DRMacIver/feedthebee/blob/master/backpressure.py))… > > > > > > I’m allowed a rate of 7/week, which means that if I have a single goal > > > > > > which is approaching its deadline I’m fine but if I have two then I will > > > > > > start to derail. > > > > > > > > > > > > I wrote a bit more about this here: > > > > > > [Playing beeminder on hard mode by adding backpressure | David R. MacIver](http://www.drmaciver.com/2014/07/playing-beeminder-on-hard-mode-by-adding-backpressure/) > > > > > > > > > > > > David > > > > > > > > > > > > – > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > > > > > > send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > > > > > – > > > > > [http://dreev.es](http://dreev.es) – search://“Daniel Reeves” > > > > > Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == [http://beeminder.com](http://beeminder.com) > > > > > > > > > > – > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > > > – > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > – > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > > > – > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > > Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > > > an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > > > – > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). > > – > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > “Akratics Anonymous” group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout). – You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com](mailto:akratics+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). For more options, visit [https://groups.google.com/d/optout](https://groups.google.com/d/optout).