Pessimistic presumptions not really working out for me

My initial reaction to the pessimistic presumptions in “do less” goals is
that they were a great idea, as I’d previously been very skeptical of do
less goals because of exactly the thing where forgetting about the goal
causes it to stay safe that they’re designed to solve.

The reality is that I’m finding them annoying and not actually that
helpful.

The problem is that I have 6 “do less” goals which don’t come from some
automatic source of data (I’ve turned pessimistic presumptions off for
automatically populated goals of course) and all but one of them are pegged
to less than one a day (most of them are set so that I’d only ever enter
data for them once or twice a week). Entering data for them when I do them
is relatively easy because I have the cue of actually doing the thing I’m
tracking, but I inevitably forget the ones I haven’t done on a given day
and then have to later cumbersomely go through all the relevant goals and
delete any pessimistic data-points.

As well as just being slightly annoying this makes me much less inclined to
add new “do less” goals for rare-ish events because I know they’ll add a
lot of overhead to my workflow.

My current plan is just to turn it off on all my do less goals and see if I
actually need the enforcement to keep me entering data (currently it
doesn’t feel like I do, but I’m a bit skeptical). Does anyone have any
better strategies they’ve tried?

David


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Just to make sure, you know that Pessimistic Presumptive Reports are
self-destructing now, right? So you can just enter a zero datapoint,
even retroactively, and the PPR will disappear. Not sure if that
removes enough of the cumbersomeness.

(It’s thanks to Philip Hellyer that it does that. I resisted on
anti-magic grounds but it turned out I was being too dogmatic about
it. Auto-destruct is clearly the right beehavior.)

On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 12:41 AM, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com wrote:

My initial reaction to the pessimistic presumptions in “do less” goals is
that they were a great idea, as I’d previously been very skeptical of do
less goals because of exactly the thing where forgetting about the goal
causes it to stay safe that they’re designed to solve.

The reality is that I’m finding them annoying and not actually that helpful.

The problem is that I have 6 “do less” goals which don’t come from some
automatic source of data (I’ve turned pessimistic presumptions off for
automatically populated goals of course) and all but one of them are pegged
to less than one a day (most of them are set so that I’d only ever enter
data for them once or twice a week). Entering data for them when I do them
is relatively easy because I have the cue of actually doing the thing I’m
tracking, but I inevitably forget the ones I haven’t done on a given day and
then have to later cumbersomely go through all the relevant goals and delete
any pessimistic data-points.

As well as just being slightly annoying this makes me much less inclined to
add new “do less” goals for rare-ish events because I know they’ll add a lot
of overhead to my workflow.

My current plan is just to turn it off on all my do less goals and see if I
actually need the enforcement to keep me entering data (currently it doesn’t
feel like I do, but I’m a bit skeptical). Does anyone have any better
strategies they’ve tried?

David


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http://dreev.es – search://"Daniel Reeves"
Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == http://beeminder.com

I wasn’t aware of that. It doesn’t seem any different in terms of effort
level to what I’ve been doing anyway though - it’s just as easy to delete
the datapoint as it is to add a zero one.

On 20 July 2014 10:26, Daniel Reeves dreeves@beeminder.com wrote:

Just to make sure, you know that Pessimistic Presumptive Reports are
self-destructing now, right? So you can just enter a zero datapoint,
even retroactively, and the PPR will disappear. Not sure if that
removes enough of the cumbersomeness.

(It’s thanks to Philip Hellyer that it does that. I resisted on
anti-magic grounds but it turned out I was being too dogmatic about
it. Auto-destruct is clearly the right beehavior.)

On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 12:41 AM, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com
wrote:

My initial reaction to the pessimistic presumptions in “do less” goals is
that they were a great idea, as I’d previously been very skeptical of do
less goals because of exactly the thing where forgetting about the goal
causes it to stay safe that they’re designed to solve.

The reality is that I’m finding them annoying and not actually that
helpful.

The problem is that I have 6 “do less” goals which don’t come from some
automatic source of data (I’ve turned pessimistic presumptions off for
automatically populated goals of course) and all but one of them are
pegged
to less than one a day (most of them are set so that I’d only ever enter
data for them once or twice a week). Entering data for them when I do
them
is relatively easy because I have the cue of actually doing the thing I’m
tracking, but I inevitably forget the ones I haven’t done on a given day
and
then have to later cumbersomely go through all the relevant goals and
delete
any pessimistic data-points.

As well as just being slightly annoying this makes me much less inclined
to
add new “do less” goals for rare-ish events because I know they’ll add a
lot
of overhead to my workflow.

My current plan is just to turn it off on all my do less goals and see
if I
actually need the enforcement to keep me entering data (currently it
doesn’t
feel like I do, but I’m a bit skeptical). Does anyone have any better
strategies they’ve tried?

David


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http://dreev.es – search://"Daniel Reeves"
Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == http://beeminder.com


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maybe PPR data points could be set to appear at custom intervals. If you
know you have a graph that you need to report to about every 3 days, then
you can set the PPR’s to be every 3 days. This could be in terrifyingly
advanced settings tab, or even a premium feature.

Thanks for pointing this out, David. And thanks to Philip for pushing the
auto-destruct idea, I definitely like that better.

Melanie

On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 1:37 AM, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com wrote:

I wasn’t aware of that. It doesn’t seem any different in terms of effort
level to what I’ve been doing anyway though - it’s just as easy to delete
the datapoint as it is to add a zero one.

On 20 July 2014 10:26, Daniel Reeves dreeves@beeminder.com wrote:

Just to make sure, you know that Pessimistic Presumptive Reports are
self-destructing now, right? So you can just enter a zero datapoint,
even retroactively, and the PPR will disappear. Not sure if that
removes enough of the cumbersomeness.

(It’s thanks to Philip Hellyer that it does that. I resisted on
anti-magic grounds but it turned out I was being too dogmatic about
it. Auto-destruct is clearly the right beehavior.)

On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 12:41 AM, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com
wrote:

My initial reaction to the pessimistic presumptions in “do less” goals
is
that they were a great idea, as I’d previously been very skeptical of do
less goals because of exactly the thing where forgetting about the goal
causes it to stay safe that they’re designed to solve.

The reality is that I’m finding them annoying and not actually that
helpful.

The problem is that I have 6 “do less” goals which don’t come from some
automatic source of data (I’ve turned pessimistic presumptions off for
automatically populated goals of course) and all but one of them are
pegged
to less than one a day (most of them are set so that I’d only ever enter
data for them once or twice a week). Entering data for them when I do
them
is relatively easy because I have the cue of actually doing the thing
I’m
tracking, but I inevitably forget the ones I haven’t done on a given
day and
then have to later cumbersomely go through all the relevant goals and
delete
any pessimistic data-points.

As well as just being slightly annoying this makes me much less
inclined to
add new “do less” goals for rare-ish events because I know they’ll add
a lot
of overhead to my workflow.

My current plan is just to turn it off on all my do less goals and see
if I
actually need the enforcement to keep me entering data (currently it
doesn’t
feel like I do, but I’m a bit skeptical). Does anyone have any better
strategies they’ve tried?

David


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Groups
"Akratics Anonymous" group.
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an
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For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


http://dreev.es – search://"Daniel Reeves"
Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == http://beeminder.com


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"Akratics Anonymous" group.
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The custom intervals is a good idea. Possibly with an advance panic warning
"If you don’t enter anything by the end of today you’ll get a pessimistic
data point" as at longer intervals they will probably derail you
immediately.

On 20 July 2014 10:54, Melanie Reeves Wicklow melanie@beeminder.com wrote:

maybe PPR data points could be set to appear at custom intervals. If you
know you have a graph that you need to report to about every 3 days, then
you can set the PPR’s to be every 3 days. This could be in terrifyingly
advanced settings tab, or even a premium feature.

Thanks for pointing this out, David. And thanks to Philip for pushing the
auto-destruct idea, I definitely like that better.

Melanie

On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 1:37 AM, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com
wrote:

I wasn’t aware of that. It doesn’t seem any different in terms of effort
level to what I’ve been doing anyway though - it’s just as easy to delete
the datapoint as it is to add a zero one.

On 20 July 2014 10:26, Daniel Reeves dreeves@beeminder.com wrote:

Just to make sure, you know that Pessimistic Presumptive Reports are
self-destructing now, right? So you can just enter a zero datapoint,
even retroactively, and the PPR will disappear. Not sure if that
removes enough of the cumbersomeness.

(It’s thanks to Philip Hellyer that it does that. I resisted on
anti-magic grounds but it turned out I was being too dogmatic about
it. Auto-destruct is clearly the right beehavior.)

On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 12:41 AM, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com
wrote:

My initial reaction to the pessimistic presumptions in “do less” goals
is
that they were a great idea, as I’d previously been very skeptical of
do
less goals because of exactly the thing where forgetting about the goal
causes it to stay safe that they’re designed to solve.

The reality is that I’m finding them annoying and not actually that
helpful.

The problem is that I have 6 “do less” goals which don’t come from some
automatic source of data (I’ve turned pessimistic presumptions off for
automatically populated goals of course) and all but one of them are
pegged
to less than one a day (most of them are set so that I’d only ever
enter
data for them once or twice a week). Entering data for them when I do
them
is relatively easy because I have the cue of actually doing the thing
I’m
tracking, but I inevitably forget the ones I haven’t done on a given
day and
then have to later cumbersomely go through all the relevant goals and
delete
any pessimistic data-points.

As well as just being slightly annoying this makes me much less
inclined to
add new “do less” goals for rare-ish events because I know they’ll add
a lot
of overhead to my workflow.

My current plan is just to turn it off on all my do less goals and see
if I
actually need the enforcement to keep me entering data (currently it
doesn’t
feel like I do, but I’m a bit skeptical). Does anyone have any better
strategies they’ve tried?

David


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Groups
"Akratics Anonymous" group.
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http://dreev.es – search://"Daniel Reeves"
Goal tracking + Commitment contracts == http://beeminder.com


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Groups “Akratics Anonymous” group.
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Set your reminder emails/texts to later in the day, maybe? I think early
reminders are useful for do-more goals, but later emails are probably
useful for end-of-day prompts to fill in the do-less goals.

On 20 July 2014 03:41, David MacIver david@drmaciver.com wrote:

My initial reaction to the pessimistic presumptions in “do less” goals is
that they were a great idea, as I’d previously been very skeptical of do
less goals because of exactly the thing where forgetting about the goal
causes it to stay safe that they’re designed to solve.

The reality is that I’m finding them annoying and not actually that
helpful.

The problem is that I have 6 “do less” goals which don’t come from some
automatic source of data (I’ve turned pessimistic presumptions off for
automatically populated goals of course) and all but one of them are pegged
to less than one a day (most of them are set so that I’d only ever enter
data for them once or twice a week). Entering data for them when I do them
is relatively easy because I have the cue of actually doing the thing I’m
tracking, but I inevitably forget the ones I haven’t done on a given day
and then have to later cumbersomely go through all the relevant goals and
delete any pessimistic data-points.

As well as just being slightly annoying this makes me much less inclined
to add new “do less” goals for rare-ish events because I know they’ll add a
lot of overhead to my workflow.

My current plan is just to turn it off on all my do less goals and see if
I actually need the enforcement to keep me entering data (currently it
doesn’t feel like I do, but I’m a bit skeptical). Does anyone have any
better strategies they’ve tried?

David


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